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posted by: altricial (reply) post date: 03.29.05 (8:37 am) Jimmy Hendrix death is considered suicide by some. (Eric Burdon claimed to have a note.) You can find a high rate of suicide among artists and authors as well. Perhaps for different reason, though. Many authors and artists who died by their own hand (such as Van Gogh) suffered from mental illness, and were not successful in their lifetimes. I often wonder about the relationship between pain (of virtually any sort) and creativity. It's clear that it exists, but the very awareness of the link may cause it to be over-rated. So many young people think that they MUST hurt themselves to be creatively successful. This type of forced creativity may have no merit. Many musicians who based their early careers on angst have had problems adjusting their music to the changes in their lives as they have aged. Several notable ones, Eric Clapton and Johnny Cash jumped into my head, were able to do so by remaining flexible and open to new styles, forms and collaborations. posted by: lindy (reply) post date: 03.29.05 (5:30 pm) This is one list that I don't want to add to. There was an interesting blurb on Sting's website (http://sting.com) regarding exactly this relationship between creativity and pain. He referenced the idea that [artists, musicians] think there has to be great anguish in order to have something to say, in order to be relevant. He goes on to say that he realized he was manufacturing situations that caused him to be this way and that he was destroying himself over it. I believe he is one of the few examples of someone who doesn't even really have to drastically change his style and yet comes out continuing to make great music and coming to find peace within himself. Whoops. Didn't mean to make this a Sting tribute. Just was a really great quote. posted by: lindy (reply) post date: 03.29.05 (5:36 pm) Ah, Shannon Hoon of Blind Melon. posted by: Alaric (reply) post date: 03.29.05 (5:44 pm) Personally, most of the songs that I have listened to and enjoyed over the years has come from emotional pain. We, as humans, are attracted to pain and suffering. We love conflict in any and all of its forms. It is a sick state of mind, but it is the truth. If it were not the truth, then maybe more artists, literary and otherwise, would not have so many negative mentalities. posted by: lindy (reply) post date: 03.29.05 (5:53 pm) Juni, would a drug over dose be considered 'by their own hand?' I would say yes... certainly at least Elvis would qualify as more recent information suggests the combination of drugs he ingested were of an obviously lethal combination and amount. If drug overdoeses qualify, the list just quadrupled in my mind. posted by: shadowmusic (reply) post date: 03.29.05 (8:09 pm) The good ol' Internet is certainly good at keeping track of these grim type of lists. :-| Here's a page on "Premature Deaths of Rock Stars" (including 36 suicides) at: http://www.av1611.org/rockdead.html Average age: about 37 It's such a shame for the family & fans of these artists. It all reminds me of both Bowie's song "Rock & Roll Suicide" and also the quote about the fire that burns twice as bright. posted by: surrogate (reply) post date: 03.30.05 (12:36 am) The big thrust for many musicians to end it, I'd guess, has to do with the fact that so many glean their creative sources from constantly looking inward. I'm convinced that if, for whatever reason, our focus becomes ourselves for any great length of time, the hopeless desperation of our own mortality becomes too easy to see, then to accept, and finally, to love. Add to that the external forces you mentioned and, poof! Lots of suicide. The same is true for authors, artists.... and for (who knows why?) dentists. posted by: newbie (reply) post date: 03.30.05 (3:46 am) Reply to: altricial Excellent. You have raised some good points here. I believe that all truly creative people, be they musicians or artists or authors, see the world differently than I do. Their canvases are painted with colors I've never seen. That said, I imagine that, that kind of inherent difference that is both deeply personal and impossible to explain must be, by definition, very isolating. In thinking about this topic, I was reminded in the Ray Bradbury story "All Summer In A Day." Like Margot in that story who was the only one who *knew* and believed that the sun existed, artists who see color combinations that have yet to be conceived or musicians who dream in a melodies of their own creation must suffer in a world where they are truly the square peg surrounded by perfectly round holes. *shrugs* There's more to think about here. And you've given me a lot to contemplate. Thanks. j posted by: altricial (reply) post date: 03.30.05 (7:05 am) Reply to: lindy AHAHAHA - As if you could avoid making any reference of Sting into a tribute! I remember well our conversation of Sting, and my visit to his delightful website, via your suggestion. posted by: lindy (reply) post date: 03.30.05 (8:01 am) Reply to: altricial hahaha. Well, I can not help but admire then man. He is right where I want to be in terms of spirituality. :) posted by: cmaze (reply) post date: 04.02.05 (9:27 am) Wayyyyy off topic, but I have a new domain and blog! http://www.webloxonline.com http://www.webloxonline.com/blog The blog I wanted participation on is there, so feel free ;-) posted by: juniperflux (reply) post date: 04.03.05 (8:53 pm) Reply to: lindy Listen... you are certainly welcome to praise Sting any time you want. :) There's certainly something to the concept of associating pain with creativity. I think there's something to be said for glorifying suffering as a tool for creative inspiration. I find it interesting that Sting was able to recognize his own (mis)use of that strategy as it were. Good stuff. j posted by: juniperflux (reply) post date: 04.03.05 (8:56 pm) Reply to: Alaric That is an interesting point Alaric. I think humanity does crave conflict and certainly creates chaos and tension where there is none. It's worrisome, however, when we consider how many artists find it impossible to dig their way out of the suffering the create and that we celebrate by purchasing/praising their art. Talk about your disfunctional relationships? :) Thanks for the comment. j posted by: juniperflux (reply) post date: 04.03.05 (8:58 pm) Reply to: shadowmusic Oddly enough, I almost used "Rock and Roll Suicide" as the title for this post. Average age 37?? Wow. I suppose that makes sense, but it's still a shocking number. Good things we're just pundits, huh? We'll live longer. j posted by: juniperflux (reply) post date: 04.03.05 (8:59 pm) Reply to: surrogate Wow. That is very insightful and I'm convinced true, at least in part. Self-reflection is never easy and being trapped inside yourself must be deadly. As for dentists... probably all that laughing gas, and yet not a drop to drink. :) j posted by: juniperflux (reply) post date: 04.03.05 (9:00 pm) Reply to: altricial She appears to be obsessed, Alt. But I can't blame her. He's yummy. j posted by: juniperflux (reply) post date: 04.03.05 (9:01 pm) Reply to: lindy Oh, I'd say ODing definitely qualifies as being "at your own hand." However... I was under the impression that Elvis was still alive. I hear he and DB Cooper are planning a comback tour. :) j posted by: altricial (reply) post date: 04.04.05 (3:56 am) Reply to: juniperflux Oh! Then if unintentional OD's count.... I don't think we have room for the list! Jimmy's on for sure, and Janis...Jim Morrison.... and so on, and so on, and so on.... posted by: lindy (reply) post date: 04.04.05 (5:41 am) Reply to: juniperflux hahha... 'Elvis has just left the building... those are his footprints right there...' heh. Name that artist. ;) posted by: juniperflux (reply) post date: 04.04.05 (9:44 am) Reply to: altricial Agreed. But I find it hard not to call overdosing a form of suicide. posted by: juniperflux (reply) post date: 04.04.05 (9:45 am) Reply to: lindy You know me... conspiracy theorist extraordinaire! :) posted by: altricial (reply) post date: 04.04.05 (9:48 am) Reply to: altricial I have no problem with that..... hmmm.... but I suppose intentions do count. I don't know. I have no real experience with that kind of thing. I suppose if you are doing drugs to the level required to overdose, then your concept of self is very compromised at that point. posted by: juniperflux (reply) post date: 04.04.05 (10:11 am) Reply to: altricial I think most people are fairly aware of the risks of drugs and understand that using them can/will kill you eventually. Thus, if people continue to use them and abuse their bodies, I can't see how it's not at least related to suicide, you know? I don't have much experience in this realm either. But I'm full of opinions. :) posted by: cmaze (reply) post date: 04.04.05 (1:38 pm) I can relate to the creativity being something strongly related to pain. Afterall, it is within pain that we are able to understand more about ourselves. I think for some this is something that they would rather not come to terms with. I do believe that the pressure placed upon the artist is another contributing factor - always having to make the new album, always having someone to impress. This is one of the main things that makes drinking and using such a major problem within the industry. Artists become afraid of themselves when they start wondering when it will end. Maybe they've reached the point where it hurts too much to create, but thats all they know. I have struggled with depression for quite some time and it has allowed me to be more creative and inspired. However, it has also pained me to think that the only reason I am able to create what I do is because I am depressed. I started wondering a lot about that when I started taking Zoloft since I haven't really been inspired to write the poetry I once was so familiar with. posted by: altricial (reply) post date: 04.04.05 (6:38 pm) Having lived with a serious alcoholic, I can tell you that they do not imagine death as we do. It's not the conscious decision to end one's life. It's more like a lack of decision to live one's life. My husband fortunately was forced to make the decision to live without alcohol just over a year ago. Drugs, while addictive in the same manner as alcohol, still seem fairly alien to me. More drastic in a way, so more dangerous. But to those using them, it's probably the same. posted by: lindy (reply) post date: 04.06.05 (8:30 pm) Reply to: juniperflux LOOOOL! I appear to be obsessed?! Hey! Did anyone see Dune??? oh me oh my! The man is... well, ummm... lovely. posted by: juniperflux (reply) post date: 04.06.05 (9:13 pm) Reply to: lindy Do not get me started on Mr. Sumner. :) posted by: lindy (reply) post date: 04.07.05 (5:35 am) Reply to: juniperflux hee hee hee. You knw it's bad when you start calling him by his real name. I bet Mrs. Sting doesn't even do that. hahahaa. posted by: ma543zda (reply) post date: 04.30.08 (10:12 pm) c875t |
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